Basie Ending

[OldJazzBass]

That's the name I was taught, a "Basie ending," when the bass plays C E F F#
(quarter notes) G A B C (eighth notes).

I taught myself on guitar the counter-part:
xxx768, xxx878, xxx988 --based on what I remembered from long ago, being
shown on piano, with root on top, and a couple voices underneath ascending
chromatically.

Are there other voicings or common ways you play this?

Is this cliche know by another name?

[Mark Smart]

Post by OldJazzBass
That's the name I was taught, a "Basie ending," when the bass plays C E F F#
(quarter notes) G A B C (eighth notes).
xxx768, xxx878, xxx988 --based on what I remembered from long ago, being
shown on piano, with root on top, and a couple voices underneath ascending
chromatically.
Are there other voicings or common ways you play this?
Is this cliche know by another name?

"Count Basie ending" is a good term for the chords. I do it with four-note chords:

xx7768, xx7878, xx7988

Or, on the middle four strings, in F: x5536x, x5646x, x5756x

Mark Smart
www.marksmart.net

[Richard Arnold]

Here's one -

x57x68, x67x78, x77788

Post by OldJazzBass
That's the name I was taught, a "Basie ending," when the bass plays C E F F#
(quarter notes) G A B C (eighth notes).
xxx768, xxx878, xxx988 --based on what I remembered from long ago, being
shown on piano, with root on top, and a couple voices underneath ascending
chromatically.
Are there other voicings or common ways you play this?
Is this cliche know by another name?

[sgcim]

Post by Richard Arnold
Here's one -
x57x68, x67x78, x77788

Post by OldJazzBass
That's the name I was taught, a "Basie ending," when the bass plays C E F

F#

Post by OldJazzBass
(quarter notes) G A B C (eighth notes).
xxx768, xxx878, xxx988 --based on what I remembered from long ago,

being

Post by OldJazzBass
shown on piano, with root on top, and a couple voices underneath ascending
chromatically.
Are there other voicings or common ways you play this?
Is this cliche know by another name?

For the last 2 and 1/2 years I've been playing a weekly gig in a
pianoless big band that plays a shitload of Basie charts where I'm
required to play all the piano parts, and the real Basie endings have
the tonic on the first beat followed by the iim7 b3dim7 and tonic
described previously.
I use 4 note voicings also- in C: 5558 7768 7878 10988 and then
it invariably ends on a dissonant altered chord e.g. C13+11 etc...
The Basie endings that start on the 11m7 chord are chintzy
and inauthentic and another reason why they hire keyboard players
instead of guitarists.

[Richard Arnold]

I'm sure you're an authority on chintzy and "inauthentic"- He was asking for
the last three changes - jeez!

Post by sgcim

Post by Richard Arnold
Here's one -
x57x68, x67x78, x77788

Post by OldJazzBass
That's the name I was taught, a "Basie ending," when the bass plays C E F

F#

Post by OldJazzBass
(quarter notes) G A B C (eighth notes).
xxx768, xxx878, xxx988 --based on what I remembered from long ago,

being

Post by OldJazzBass
shown on piano, with root on top, and a couple voices underneath ascending
chromatically.
Are there other voicings or common ways you play this?
Is this cliche know by another name?

For the last 2 and 1/2 years I've been playing a weekly gig in a
pianoless big band that plays a shitload of Basie charts where I'm
required to play all the piano parts, and the real Basie endings have
the tonic on the first beat followed by the iim7 b3dim7 and tonic
described previously.
I use 4 note voicings also- in C: 5558 7768 7878 10988 and then
it invariably ends on a dissonant altered chord e.g. C13+11 etc...
The Basie endings that start on the 11m7 chord are chintzy
and inauthentic and another reason why they hire keyboard players
instead of guitarists.

[sgcim]

Post by Richard Arnold
I'm sure you're an authority on chintzy and "inauthentic"- He was asking for
the last three changes - jeez!

Post by sgcim

Post by Richard Arnold
Here's one -
x57x68, x67x78, x77788

Post by OldJazzBass
That's the name I was taught, a "Basie ending," when the bass plays C

E F
F#

Post by sgcim

Post by Richard Arnold

Post by OldJazzBass
(quarter notes) G A B C (eighth notes).
xxx768, xxx878, xxx988 --based on what I remembered from long ago,

being

Post by sgcim

Post by Richard Arnold

Post by OldJazzBass
shown on piano, with root on top, and a couple voices underneath

ascending

Post by sgcim

Post by Richard Arnold

Post by OldJazzBass
chromatically.
Are there other voicings or common ways you play this?
Is this cliche know by another name?

For the last 2 and 1/2 years I've been playing a weekly gig in a
pianoless big band that plays a shitload of Basie charts where I'm
required to play all the piano parts, and the real Basie endings have
the tonic on the first beat followed by the iim7 b3dim7 and tonic
described previously.
I use 4 note voicings also- in C: 5558 7768 7878 10988 and then
it invariably ends on a dissonant altered chord e.g. C13+11 etc...
The Basie endings that start on the 11m7 chord are chintzy
and inauthentic and another reason why they hire keyboard players
instead of guitarists.

Yeah, but a lot of charts and players leave the first change out- as I
said, yet another reason why they don't call guitarists, along with
the intro to songs like "A"Train", "Mr. Lucky" "Lil Darlin" etc...

[OldJazzBass]

Post by sgcim

Post by sgcim
For the last 2 and 1/2 years I've been playing a weekly gig in a
pianoless big band that plays a shitload of Basie charts where I'm
required to play all the piano parts, and the real Basie endings have
the tonic on the first beat followed by the iim7 b3dim7 and tonic
described previously.
I use 4 note voicings also- in C: 5558 7768 7878 10988 and then
it invariably ends on a dissonant altered chord e.g. C13+11 etc...
The Basie endings that start on the 11m7 chord are chintzy
and inauthentic and another reason why they hire keyboard players
instead of guitarists.

Yeah, but a lot of charts and players leave the first change out- as I
said, yet another reason why they don't call guitarists, along with
the intro to songs like "A"Train", "Mr. Lucky" "Lil Darlin" etc...

Who's "they" ?

What's "11m7" and what's the authentic alternative?

[sgcim]

Post by OldJazzBass

Post by sgcim

Post by sgcim
For the last 2 and 1/2 years I've been playing a weekly gig in a
pianoless big band that plays a shitload of Basie charts where I'm
required to play all the piano parts, and the real Basie endings have
the tonic on the first beat followed by the iim7 b3dim7 and tonic
described previously.
I use 4 note voicings also- in C: 5558 7768 7878 10988 and then
it invariably ends on a dissonant altered chord e.g. C13+11 etc...
The Basie endings that start on the 11m7 chord are chintzy
and inauthentic and another reason why they hire keyboard players
instead of guitarists.

Yeah, but a lot of charts and players leave the first change out- as I
said, yet another reason why they don't call guitarists, along with
the intro to songs like "A"Train", "Mr. Lucky" "Lil Darlin" etc...

Who's "they" ?
What's "11m7" and what's the authentic alternative?

They = Guys that call musicians for big bands
iim7 = a minor seventh chord whose root is the second note of the
major scale-e.g. Dm7 is the iim7 in the key of C
Authentic Alternative = playing C Dm7 Ebdim7 C with the note C as the
top note, rather than playing just the last 3 chords- Dm7 Ebdim C.

[Mike DiFebbo]

Post by sgcim

Post by sgcim
For the last 2 and 1/2 years I've been playing a weekly gig in a
pianoless big band that plays a shitload of Basie charts where I'm
required to play all the piano parts, and the real Basie endings have
the tonic on the first beat followed by the iim7 b3dim7 and tonic
described previously.

There is no such thing as a single "real Basie ending" that fits every
chart. Assuming that we're defining a "Basie ending" for this
discussion as a 1 or 2 measure piano break followed by the band ending
on a I13(#11) chord or something similar, there are many very well
known Basie tunes that have no "Basie ending" at all:

-Lester Leaps In, Jumpin' at the Woodside and One O'Clock Jump from
"Count Basie 1937-1943"
-Wind Machine
-April in Paris
-Corner Pocket
-Strike Up the Band
-Shiny Stockings

There are Basie tunes that have single note "Basie endings":
-Oh, Lady Be Good!
-Flight of the Foo Birds
-Kid from Red Bank (actually octaves)
-Lil' Darlin' (2 notes--C and then C an octave higher)
-Whirlybird

There are tunes that *clearly* have 3-chord (as opposed to to 4-chord)
endings:
-Splanky
-Prime Time

I'm not saying that the 4-chord "Basie ending" that you're describing
doesn't exist. Indeed, I'm sure it does, but none of the 20 or so
tunes that I listened to in preparing this message had it, so I have
to disagree with your sweeping generalization that the 4-chord ending
is somehow more "real" or "authentic" than the 3-chord version that
folks described at the top of this thread.

Post by sgcim
They = Guys that call musicians for big bands
iim7 = a minor seventh chord whose root is the second note of the
major scale-e.g. Dm7 is the iim7 in the key of C
Authentic Alternative = playing C Dm7 Ebdim7 C with the note C as the
top note, rather than playing just the last 3 chords- Dm7 Ebdim C.

Let's face it, when "they" call musicians to play an "authentic" Basie
ending, "they" call a piano player, not a guitar player.

Michael DiFebbo
____________________________________
http://www.jazzexplosion.com

[sgcim]

Post by Mike DiFebbo

Post by sgcim

Post by sgcim
For the last 2 and 1/2 years I've been playing a weekly gig in a
pianoless big band that plays a shitload of Basie charts where I'm
required to play all the piano parts, and the real Basie endings have
the tonic on the first beat followed by the iim7 b3dim7 and tonic
described previously.

There is no such thing as a single "real Basie ending" that fits every
chart. Assuming that we're defining a "Basie ending" for this
discussion as a 1 or 2 measure piano break followed by the band ending
on a I13(#11) chord or something similar, there are many very well
-Lester Leaps In, Jumpin' at the Woodside and One O'Clock Jump from
"Count Basie 1937-1943"
-Wind Machine
-April in Paris
-Corner Pocket
-Strike Up the Band
-Shiny Stockings
-Oh, Lady Be Good!
-Flight of the Foo Birds
-Kid from Red Bank (actually octaves)
-Lil' Darlin' (2 notes--C and then C an octave higher)
-Whirlybird
There are tunes that *clearly* have 3-chord (as opposed to to 4-chord)
-Splanky
-Prime Time
I'm not saying that the 4-chord "Basie ending" that you're describing
doesn't exist. Indeed, I'm sure it does, but none of the 20 or so
tunes that I listened to in preparing this message had it, so I have
to disagree with your sweeping generalization that the 4-chord ending
is somehow more "real" or "authentic" than the 3-chord version that
folks described at the top of this thread.

Post by sgcim
They = Guys that call musicians for big bands
iim7 = a minor seventh chord whose root is the second note of the
major scale-e.g. Dm7 is the iim7 in the key of C
Authentic Alternative = playing C Dm7 Ebdim7 C with the note C as the
top note, rather than playing just the last 3 chords- Dm7 Ebdim C.

Let's face it, when "they" call musicians to play an "authentic" Basie
ending, "they" call a piano player, not a guitar player.
Michael DiFebbo
____________________________________
http://www.jazzexplosion.com

Obviously, his arrangers did not use that ending for every tune
(although just to fuck peoples heads up we've ended every tune on a
four hour gig that way- even ballads- and have wound up pissing our
pants it's so funny), but Sammy Nestico usually used it in tunes like
"Basie Straight Ahead", "Down Basie Street" and others.
We'll play "Splanky" Wednesday night so I'll look at the chart.
The 3 chord ending still sounds honkified to me and sounds like it
would be played by pseudo-jazzers like Paul Shaffer, that guy that did
the "Stray Cat Blues" and that fucking awful Conan O'Brian band (not
Conan).

[Marc Sabatella]

Post by Mike DiFebbo
I'm not saying that the 4-chord "Basie ending" that you're describing
doesn't exist. Indeed, I'm sure it does, but none of the 20 or so
tunes that I listened to in preparing this message had it, so I have
to disagree with your sweeping generalization that the 4-chord ending
is somehow more "real" or "authentic" than the 3-chord version that
folks described at the top of this thread.

True enough, and I've played enough of these arrangements to know many
of these variations. Still, there is "real" in the sense of what Basie
himself might have actually used, and "real" in the sense of what
everyone else means by the term when they call for it. The cliche has
taken on a life of its own, and I think the most common is IV #ivo I,
followed by the rest of the band on the I chord again. It is often
voiced in way more suggestive of ii #iio I, but if the bass plays along,
it is usually more appropriate to start on IV.

--------------
Marc Sabatella
***@outsideshore.com

The Outside Shore
Music, art, & educational materials:
http://www.outsideshore.com/

[Joey Goldstein]

Post by OldJazzBass
That's the name I was taught, a "Basie ending," when the bass plays C E F F#
(quarter notes) G A B C (eighth notes).
xxx768, xxx878, xxx988 --based on what I remembered from long ago, being
shown on piano, with root on top, and a couple voices underneath ascending
chromatically.
Are there other voicings or common ways you play this?
Is this cliche know by another name?

I think there might be two different endings you're dealing with here.

What I know as "The Basie Ending" does not involve that ascending bass line.
It's simply:
/ / IIm7 / |Idim7 / I6 / |
with the tonic in the top voice, the I6 chord played on the and of 2 and
the other two chords played short.
The voice in the bass can vary but usually it's the tonic (i.e. a pedal).

The bass line you cite I've always thought of as coming originally from
Duke's Take The A Train. This is the ending Chuck sSher has on his chart
for this tune.
If I were harmonizing this ending I'd use something like:
C C7/E F F#dim C/G C/A G7/B C

There is a descending clichéd bass line ending too:
C Bb A Ab G F E C
Around here we think of that as the Swingin' Sheppard's Blues from Moe Koffman.

C C7/Bb F/A Fm/Ab C/G

[Joey Goldstein]

Post by Joey Goldstein
C Bb A Ab G F E C
Around here we think of that as the Swingin' Sheppard's Blues from Moe Koffman.
C C7/Bb F/A Fm/Ab C/G

Actually that's not true. Swingin' Sheppard has that line in the lead
while the bass plays the A Train ending:

C Bb A Ab G F E C
C E F F# G A B C
C C7/E F F#dim7(9) C/G F G13/B C
or Ab7/Gb

[Mark Smart]

Post by Joey Goldstein
Actually that's not true. Swingin' Sheppard has that line in the lead
C Bb A Ab G F E C
C E F F# G A B C
C C7/E F F#dim7(9) C/G F G13/B C
or Ab7/Gb

I like to play this ending on Chapman Stick, except I use an Eb on the
next to last melody note, and transpose the last three bass notes down
an octave for easier reach in fifths tuning:

+-------------------------+
+-15----------------------+
+----18-17-16-15----------+
+----------------18-16----+
+----------------------18-+
+-------------------------+
| |
+=12=============9==11=12=+
+----9--10-11-12----------+
+-------------------------+
+-------------------------+
+-------------------------+
+-------------------------+

Mark Smart
www.marksmart.net

[sgcim]

Post by Mark Smart

Post by Joey Goldstein
Actually that's not true. Swingin' Sheppard has that line in the lead
C Bb A Ab G F E C
C E F F# G A B C
C C7/E F F#dim7(9) C/G F G13/B C
or Ab7/Gb

I like to play this ending on Chapman Stick, except I use an Eb on the
next to last melody note, and transpose the last three bass notes down
+-------------------------+
+-15----------------------+
+----18-17-16-15----------+
+----------------18-16----+
+----------------------18-+
+-------------------------+
| |
+=12=============9==11=12=+
+----9--10-11-12----------+
+-------------------------+
+-------------------------+
+-------------------------+
+-------------------------+
Mark Smart
www.marksmart.net

I think I've finally figured out what bothers me so much about some
uses of the Basie ending.
The whole point of the Basie ending is that it comes right after a
huge build-up of chords which end on the dominant (or bII7), and the
Basie ending starts on the I chord (even if another instrument plays
the root of the I chord first, and then is followed by the other 3
chords previously mentioned.
The effect is fantastic if done this way, but some people do it after
they've already resolved the dominant to the tonic, resulting in a
cheesy, cliched sound that lacks the effect that Basie's great
arrangers used so well.